In this episode of the Racing Insiders Podcast, Kate and Steve discuss performance oil, air leaks, and name calling. They also discuss 602 vs 604, oil pressure, carbs, racing losing fans and drivers, and why you need to change valve springs. 

Which do you prefer a 602 or 604? (6:35)

Um, it just depends on the application. Obviously, if you're allowed to run a 604, then that would be my first choice. 602, is obviously my second choice. But I mean, I don't have a preference either way. Because usually most classes are spelled out by either/or, I think in some of the late model stuff, you can still run 602s against 604s. But you can never run a 604 against 602 in most divisions. 

Do you have any trouble with 602 heads cracking? (7:14)

Very rarely, actually. I know what you're referring to as a thin wall casting, it's a Vortech head. So no, not unless you're experiencing extreme temperatures, have I seen one crack. That would be extremely rare.

I'm running 10W30 Schaefers and a 604 crate in 94 degree weather - oil pressure down to 25 at idle after 25 lap feature thoughts on going to 20W50? On alcohol. (8:05)

I mean, you probably could in that scenario. I don't necessarily like the 20W50 aspect of it. That would certainly go to like a 10W40. And that will help that. But you know, that being said, at an idle, it's 25 pounds. I don't really care what it is at an idle. I mean, you need to be more concerned about what it is on the track at full throttle. So I think you're probably fine. But the 10W40 will help keep the lifters pumped up once the oil temperature gets up that high to where you're actually experiencing those oil pressures.

Will the Hendren 604 carb on E85 work on a 602 crate engine? (9:03)

Yeah, so there's very little difference between the 602/604 and even believe it or not 525 on those carburetors. So, that carburetor work on any of the three combinations.

Do you sell five pound fire suppression systems? (9:27)

Yes, I do. Yeah, I'm trying to think of what iterations we have. Whether they're automatic or if they're manual. I don't think I have a both situation with the the five pound ones, but I'd have to look so. So yeah, I think they're I think they're either manual or automatic. Manual means that you pull the cord and that's when they go off and then automatic would be where they've got the little glass tube that will break at 170 degrees and automatically set off the system.

What is the best way to gain horsepower on a 602 with a class having to run only 4412 cards? (12:34)

Honestly, at that point its like, essentially like running a go kart motor. So anything you can do. I wouldn't necessarily be looking at the engine, I'd be looking at what you can do, externally. So exhaust, freeing up the car as far as like what we'll burn. I mean, we learn all this stuff in the chassis dyno. What wheel bearings can you run? What hubs are you using? How wide is everything? I mean, the thing with crate engines, I don't care whether you're on a 2 barrel or 4 barrel -  light and friction free makes you fast. So anything you do there is going to help you. I mean, that 2 barrel, you're stuck with that. I mean, that's, unfortunately, a pile of crap. But I mean, everything, everything you do otherwise, other than that is going to help you.

Is it just me or has racing fallen off in the last year or so what needs to be done to get new folks involved? (14:00)

(Steve) Well, I mean, it depends on the area area you're talking about. I mean, in the Carolinas, you've got different series that are I don't know, it's a weird situation here. If you got north, no racing hasn't fallen off. It's gotten better. You get down south. No, it hasn't fallen off. It's gotten better. Right here in the middle. And it depends on the kind of racing you're talking about. Crate racing. Yeah, it's fallen off. Reason being is we don't have a series that, you know, basically comes in here and sanctions a bunch of race tracks. So that's kind of my opinion. 

(Kate) I would say you want to get more people at the track, then don't make the shows eight hours long. I didn't even want to do five hours of BarbenHeimer. So I did it in two sections, people do not have the patience to sit at a track for six to eight hours. And who wants to who wants to be there so late that it ruins the next day. I mean, who wants to be at a racetrack until 1, 2, 3 in the morning. I mean, if it's Friday night, then your Saturday morning shot. And that's kind of like your one free day. And if its Saturday night, it makes it really hard to get up and go to church. And that's important to a lot of people. You know. And so I understand that tracks want to make money and running a bunch of divisions, but have a schedule and follow a schedule. Make it exciting, make it fun, don't drag stuff out forever and ever and ever, in a day, go to some  regional baseball games,  and see what they do to keep the crowd engaged and try to take in some of those types of things. We've got the Forest City Owls and I haven't been doing Owls game, but you know, Hickory Crawdads, like any of those regional those, those minor league, baseball games are gonna kind of show the way. Baseball is probably the most boring sport. I mean, hate me all you want. But I think baseball is boring. It's like fun to play, boring to watch. But you go to one of those minor league baseball games, and it's a fun experience to be there. And racing should be an experience. It should be an event, it should daze and mesmerize and make it so that it's it like you can connect the people and make it exciting. Like that's the most important part. But we it's not exciting when it's eight hours.

Have you done much for dyno testing with the Gibbs Driven GP1 10w30? And if so, how does it compare power wise to your top performing oils? (21:51)

I can tell you about the Gibbs stuff. I have tested that time and time again, over the years. And what I've noticed. I mean, I don't want to bash anybody's oil. But what I can tell you is, the times I've tested it, I can make 5, 6, 7, 8 passes on chassis dyno. And that oil makes power. I can shut the car off, leave it overnight, same weather conditions, same room temperature, same everything the next day, and I'm down on power. So what I've come to determine, my own personal self, is they've got additives in there that will actually make some power. And it burns out of there. I'm not a fan of the Gibbs stuff. I'm just not. And I've done this, I didn't do it once I've done this, like three or four times. And the results have been the same every time. I mean, does it protect the engine doesn't work? Yeah. Is it my first choice. All means no.

Open 602, 2 barrel Holley XP, first upgrade since the seals have been broken. 0.93 seconds off the pace. (25:35)

I mean, it can be I mean, that can be car. Honestly. I mean, a lot of people overlook a lot of people when it can be carved your selection. Any numbers? Any number of things driver? I mean, not knocking the driver, but I mean, it could be anything. It could be anything. Give Steve a call tomorrow and you can discuss it. 

My buddy, a mechanic, says changing valve springs on a 602 is unnecessary. What can I tell him, or what names can I call him to convince him he's wrong? (27:43)

A dumbass would be the first thing that would come across my vocabulary. No, you do need to change valve springs on those 602s. Because the 602 valve springs basically suck. They're absolutely horrible. So no, I mean, I just say dumbass change your springs. 

There is a big difference between the 602 springs and the 604 Beehives. 602s are pretty weak. I'm sure you've seen some broken springs. You can enter valve float sooner in the RPM range. So I mean, I normally recommend on my customers on 602s, that they're changing springs every five races. You know, if they're beating the hell out of the rev limiter might need to be every three races. Unless you're running against him, then you can tell him he doesn't need to change his springs. They'll last a whole season!

Do you tune the headers when they are new? (32:27)

No, you're talking to the old school- paint a line on the collector and that's your on the extension. And that's where you cut it off. I assume that's what you're talking about. Sounds like it? No, that's not something that we do. Yeah, because that's, that's kind of old wives tale stuff. I mean, any headers have come to a whole other level. Totally differently. Even in like the almost 10 years I've been doing Crate Insider that headers have made leaps and bounds in the crate world for sure.

What is your opinion on champions plugs? (33:35)

I mean, we use them. So champion, yeah, I've used champion before. I don't really have a recommendation for like a crate engine. But years and years ago, we were using those and like super late model engines, and limited motors and stuff.

602s on E85. Do you have a favorite fuel? Is the 85 available at the gas stations bad news? (34:03)

Yeah, so I mean, I've always been a VP guy. So I'm going to always promote VP, I can tell you that the VP fuel is one of the most consistent that I've ever been around. Like you buy a drum of, you know, E85 today, and you buy one two months from now, and you test it and its the same. I can't say the same thing for like Sunoco or any of any of the other brands that are out there. They vary actually quite a bit from my testing, and then you get to gas stations, I would not buy that because of contamination. Not only water contamination but the silt and everything else you get on in ground pumps. So it It's not something I would recommend.

We had the unfortunate experience of ventilating a 604 with low laps, looking like a rod was a little tight- blue on the journal. (35:05)

That does not surprise me. Honestly. We run into that every day, which is why we do what we do and, you know, taking things apart. We do what GM can't do, and actually, number one, make them all equal. But number two, guarantee that you're not going to have a tight rod. Like, I mean, you wouldn't you wouldn't believe what we've seen. I mean, I've had engines come through with you know, half 1000 Rod bearing clearance. How long is that gonna live? You've bought the thing, GM isn't gonna cover it, because they're gonna blame it on "Oh, your time your car wrong or something like or did the ignition wrong" or something like that. I mean, a lot of people think that, you know, we got crap for years with the whole blueprinting. From a couple series, not like the good series, not the ones that are actually, you know, actually successful right now. But we got shit for years, over, supposedly selling like a false bill of goods to people. And that's not what we were selling, we were selling basically, like an insurance policy. Because once you buy it, you own it, GM is not going to replace it. It's very rare GM ever does anything to replace anything. For anyone who has a catastrophic, you know, failure. I'd say one in 1 in 1000, or maybe one in 500. So now we, we do what we do. Primarily, like I said, because we can do what GM can't do and make everything equal. And that goes for like my buddy Jason on here, he does the same thing. He's in Erie, Pennsylvania. And he does the same thing I do. The thing that he and I share in common is we actually do the work on these things. So you know, there is there is a deal right now, where a lot of these guys out here, you know, saying we're blueprinting engines are not actually doing. Taking apart, change the silicone, put it back together, charging a bunch of money and go. 

Do you, or can you, seal an engine with a genuine GM seal? (45:16)

No, you cannot. Nobody can.